55 replies to this topic

[ironrattler]

Good job WOS87 with the stats! I know that took a lot of time and work. I was wondering if the stats were loaded in a database and you could tweak out some more. I was thinking like 60's, 70's, etc. I was always led to believe my alma mater Jacksboro was the third winningest in the 60's behind brownwood and Plano. I was a captain of the 1971 AA State Champs and was just wondering?

[Exporter]

If I cam pick one team for one year back over forty years ago - I pick the Baytown Ganders.

They had three Future ALL-Americans on that team. Tom Stolhandski was the best known- 3 years all-American End at Texas. Then there was a QB and a RB who were All-American at Rice. The QB played pro ball. That RB was about 6 feet tall and 210 lbs - he gave me some bruises in 1948.

Yep the Baytown Ganders ( formerly the Goose Creek Ganders) had a total of 6 players who played for Southwest Conference Teams. One of the great tackles, I think by the name of MOAK went to A&M.

[G-P king]

I always see CC Calallen at the top in the Corpus Christi area. I have yet to see them get out of their area in the playoffs. Their win percentage and win loss totals must be because they have no competition there. A friend that is a Katy fan is working there and has said that there isn't much in that area. That Calallen isn't much of a contender even though they dominate that area. I am sure there could be a more legitimate team in the top ten list for 1995 - 2004. Most of the teams in each category for each of the years have had competition in their districts or areas and have had success in the playoffs. Their totals represent solid programs that produce the results to prove they are or have been true powerhouses. Anyone have a good argument for Calallen, could not find them in a state final ever.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

CC calallen got third in district last year. They have only been good in the last 20 years. G-P has dominated that area for way longer since the 60's. They had 12 consecutive district championships in a row State Record.

[WOS87]

Good job WOS87 with the stats! I know that took a lot of time and work. I was wondering if the stats were loaded in a database and you could tweak out some more. I was thinking like 60's, 70's, etc. I was always led to believe my alma mater Jacksboro was the third winningest in the 60's behind brownwood and Plano. I was a captain of the 1971 AA State Champs and was just wondering?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You are quite correct... Jacksboro had the highest win percentage of any team in the 60's and won more games than any team other than Brownwood and Denver City.

[LoboFan07]

Don't think so big guy.  Permian (Mojo) rolled over whoever stood in the way.

Except for 1975

Beat us by 1 point *screams* then go on to get rolled (literally) in the State Championship game.

[Fan-Cat-stic]

<_< Isn't it funny how people will argue with the Statistics if either CC Calallen or Gregory Portland are anywhere near the top. Geeze ... can't you guys give credit where credit is due :wtf:

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[Cowtown_Horn]

Had a lot of respect for your post, until I saw ROGERS near the top of a couple of the polls.
FACT: Rogers never won state
FACT: Rogers came close once. I was there at Texas Stadium that dreary, rainy, night. Stanton owned them from the gun, 33-7.

If you were looking to say: "hey, the Ennis Lions RULE", then just say it. They HAVE dominated 4A the past five years. But spare me some of the others. Rogers has run up some stats, but what have they accomplished?

Rosebud-Lott 41
Rogers 22

From a smiling RLHS grad

(12,500 in WISD Stadium that night---nearly a record (#3 all-time, if not mistaken)---cars were backed up for miles for that state semifinal game---I was on my honeymoon in P. Vallarta)

Mickey Meacham
Aledo Bearcats, TX

(Congrats on your W's, Lions. I felt you earned them both years, and with a lot of class on your players' parts).

[WOS87]

Had a lot of respect for your post, until I saw ROGERS near the top of a couple of the polls.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not quite sure who this post is directed to, but if you're referring to my initial post, it is not a poll. It is in FACT, a purely statistical, objective ranking of the actual number of wins and losses the teams in question have had over several arbitrary windows of time.

I have no particular bias towards any teams I have listed other than my own alma mater.... which by the way is not on any of the lists for the past 5, 10 or 15 years....

Don't put any blame on me because Rogers happens to be one of the 10 winningest teams of the past 5 years. Argue all you want about strength of schedule, championships etc. but you can't really argue with the numbers.

Rogers has run up some stats, but what have they accomplished?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, what they have accomplished is to put up a 62-8 record in the past 5 seasons which is better than 99.5% of any of the schools in the state and that's the only point the post was trying to make.

[nevadafan]

How long did it take you to compile all of the data? Impressive!

[PSHS88]

Don't think so big guy.  Permian (Mojo) rolled over whoever stood in the way.  Odessa was one of three high schools, eventually two, in a city of less than 100,000 and it never got any bigger.  In fact some of the best success was enjoyed as the city was shrinking after the oil slump in the early-1980s.  I've seen alot of teams play since I started watching in 1971 and I haven't seen any big-time successful 5A teams built on the same platform as the old Permian teams.  That is, a small city a very long way from any metropolitan area with a generally low average income.  Most of the big schools you are seeing successful today are outgrowths of large metropolitan areas--Southlake Carroll, Smithson Valley, Judson.  I would even lump Midland Lee and Midland High into the equation with Midland historically being a little smaller but a little wealthier than Odessa.  There is no equal to Midland/Odessa football anywhere in the State.  Find me any town or towns close together with less than 200,000 people who have put so many teams in 5A state championship games.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I quote Tom Kimbrough, the greatest Texas High School football coach in history. "We just never got all wrapped up in that MOJO stuff." This was after the author of Friday Night Lights called him and asked him about several games in which Plano beat Permian. He later said, "I hope I'm not ruining your little book." Permian never has and never will beat the Wildcats of Plano Sr. High.

[SLC 2002]

This is a nice fact to know but you also have to consider the fact that its easier to build a power house in 3A or 4A then it is in 5A. Also, most of the 5A schools that were or are big powerhouse teams are the only high schools in a growing city. Consider what the difference would be say if Austin had one football team or San Antonio or even Arlington. Those teams would of rolled over teams like Southlake Carroll the old Permian teams. If I am not mistaken Lamar was the winningest 5A team in the 90's.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The difference is you are putting one high school in cities with populations ranging from 300,000 to 1,000,000 compared to a little over 20,000 in Southlake for example.

[WOS87]

Just posting to point out that I've updated the original posting to include 2005 win-loss records and advanced the time windows by a year... there were some pretty big changes... also, there are a lot teams that are neck and neck going into the final two or three games of the year...

Edited by WOS87, 04 December 2005 - 06:39 PM.

[WOS87]

Added Dynasty records to the original post....

[OUMojo83]

For the 1 season win by highest number, you left out the state champion Permian teams of 1989 and 1991, both of which went 16-0.

[WOS87]

For the 1 season win by highest number, you left out the state champion Permian teams of 1989 and 1991, both of which went 16-0.

There were 4 or 5 programs who have had exactly two 16-0-0 seasons in their history so I just included the 4 that have done it 3 or more times on the table above for reasons of space...

[OUMojo83]

There were 4 or 5 programs who have had exactly two 16-0-0 seasons in their history so I just included the 4 that have done it 3 or more times on the table above for reasons of space...

Ah... makes sense. Thanks.

[WOS87]

..

[WOS87]

Best ever table added to original post...

[reyescoach]

They've never been in a State Final, but they haven't missed the playoffs since Phil Danaher got there in '85.

As far as the area, they probably play in the toughest area in Region IV... same district as Gregory-Portland and Alice. The Wildcats own the state record for most consecutive 10-win seasons, a record which dated back to 1988 and was snapped this past season (went 9-4) at 16 seasons.

Made five consecutive appearances in the State Semis from 93-97, losing to LaMarque each time. Their last real power team was the '00 team. That was really the last state contender they fielded, but that team flamed out in the Semis just like the teams of the 90's. West Orange-Stark pulled off the W in that contest with a game-winning TD drive with less than a minute to play.

Only one of those State Semifinal games (the '94 game against LaMarque) was out of reach late in the fourth. Calallen lost that game by 22.

About the area, the district put a team in the Semis every year from 92 until 2000. Nine straight appearances and a team in the Semis 11 of 12 years starting in '92. But even with all that tradition in the last 15 years, 31-4A has failed to send a team to the dance during that span.

The last two or three years have been G-P's years, but have been down years overall for that district. The coaching is there (Danaher's a legend along with G-P's George Harris, former frontman for 2A powerhouse Refugio) but the talent level is down a little.

CALALLEN STATE SEMIFINAL APPEARANCES

1993 vs. LaMarque L, 33-31
1994 vs. LaMarque L, 36-14
1995 vs. LaMarque L, 32-21
1996 vs. LaMarque L, 24-21 (OT)
1997 vs. LaMarque L, 13-3
2000 vs. West Orange-Stark L, 27-21
I don't know what you mean by CC area. Maybe you're referring to Region IV??? Their district (CC Flour Bluff, CC Calallen, CC Tuloso-Midway, Rockport-Fulton, Gregory-Portland, Alice, Robstown and Kingsville) is the only one in the CC area. Only one other 4A team (Beeville) is within an hour-and-a-half drive from Corpus.

Like I said, they haven't been at the top of the 4A ranks in the Coastal Bend for the past couple years. But if you're talking about the playoffs they've made it at least two rounds deep every year since 1990. Most of those runs ended in the Quarterfinals and six have ended in the Semis. Did this answer your question?

As mentioned before, there is no real competition - TM?, Robstown?, Kingsville?, Rockport? - plus valley teams in non-district and playoffs?, plus other CC teams in non-district? They are going to win 7-8 games guaranteed every year. I agree, move them out of the conversation of top teams.